Goals vs. Expectations: Finding the Sweet Spot

Goals vs. Expectations: Finding the Sweet Spot

Are you setting goals, or are you just chasing unrealistic expectations? In this episode of the C-Suite Chicks podcast, Ashlie Marshall and Whitney Ramirez tackle this very question. As they wrap up summer and prepare for back-to-school season, the conversation shifts to the often blurred lines between setting achievable goals and managing the expectations that come from within ourselves, society, and even our closest relationships.

Episode 13 of the C-Suite Chicks is a candid exploration of how these concepts play out in our daily lives. Ashlie kicks things off by defining the difference between a goal—a planned effort with a clear intention—and an expectation, which is often an unspoken belief that something should happen, sometimes without any real basis in reality. The hosts delve into how these expectations can be self-imposed or absorbed from societal norms, such as the pressure on women to have children by a certain age or to reach specific milestones like marriage or home ownership.

Whitney shares her personal struggles with perfectionism, explaining how she often sets unattainable standards for herself in every role she plays—whether as a parent, friend, or employee. This desire to be perfect is something many of us can relate to, especially in a world where social media constantly bombards us with images of others seemingly living their best, most polished lives. Ashlie echoes this sentiment, recounting her own unrealistic expectations about maintaining relationships with her nieces and nephews after becoming a mother herself. These moments of vulnerability make it clear that the expectations we set for ourselves can sometimes be our own worst enemies.

The episode also highlights the importance of communication, particularly when it comes to understanding the expectations others might have for us. Ashlie and Whitney discuss the necessity of being "fiercely honest" in these conversations, both in expressing our own needs and in clarifying what is expected of us by others. This honesty, while sometimes uncomfortable, can prevent misunderstandings and help us manage our own mental and emotional well-being.

As the discussion wraps up, the hosts encourage listeners to reflect on the expectations they’ve placed on themselves and to consider whether these are truly serving their best interests. They also remind us that goals should be challenging but attainable, and that it’s okay to give ourselves grace when we fall short. After all, no one is perfect—and that's perfectly okay.

If you’ve ever felt the weight of unrealistic expectations, this episode is a must-listen. It’s a powerful reminder that while goals are essential for growth, they should not come at the expense of our mental health or happiness. Tune in to episode 13 of C-Suite Chicks for more insights, and don’t forget to share it with anyone who might need a little help navigating their own goals and expectations.

‍

Ashlie Marshall (00:00):

We've got goals. It's important to set them in a way that's achievable, attainable, realistic, but the difference between the goals that you set and the expectations that you place on yourself and the process of achieving those goals, there has to be a healthy balance. Hey y'all, its the C-Suite Chicks. How's it going?

Whitney Ramirez (00:28):

Hello?

Ashlie Marshall (00:29):

Oh, we're wrapping up summer in this house, and I am so ready for my kids to go to school.

Whitney Ramirez (00:38):

Rome's already in school, so he is chucking right along, going from summer to fall.

Ashlie Marshall (00:46):

Yeah, I'm ready for this schedule. Yeah, I'm always ready for this schedule to end, but I am always ready for it to come back into my life.

Whitney Ramirez (00:58):

I feel like it gets more fun too. You get to do the meet the teacher stuff.

Ashlie Marshall (01:02):

Oh yeah, we do the Meet the teacher next week. It's going to be interesting. Harley starts kindergarten, so she's been in preschool, but this is big girl stuff, so I don't know where to see how we go. Dom's going in a third, and we do meet the teacher next week. So they both have it on the same day. It'll be interesting. Today we kind of want to chit-chat about goals and expectations, the difference, the reality of them, how we manage them on a daily basis. So the first thing is defining them, right? What's the difference between a goal and an expectation? And the goal is an intention of an activity or a plan of something that includes actual effort, determination, and planning out what that looks like to achieve that goal. But an expectation is the belief that you or someone will or should achieve something at some point, and maybe part of that expectation is it should be achieved by now. What is one of the biggest things that pops into my head is individuals who go through midlife crisis because women have it, men have it, they all have it, right? You think you should be somewhere at a certain age, and when you're not, you lose your mind and you don't know how to deal with it. So that is a great example of an unrealistic or a misperceived expectation, right? Yeah. What do you think of when we talk about roles and expectations?

Whitney Ramirez (02:43):

I think a lot of, there's a lot of societal, expect, societal expectation on women to have kids at a certain point, or I think that's probably the biggest one. Or get at some point, or by some age, I guess. Well,

Ashlie Marshall (03:05):

I think that that's totally true. That's kind of where the midlife crisis situation comes from, is society says that I should be married and popping babies out by 30,

Whitney Ramirez (03:14):

Right? Yeah. It's crazy. So I think of that for sure.

Ashlie Marshall (03:20):

Yeah, back in the day it was if you were 25 and not married, you're a spinster and you were never going to meet a man, right?

Whitney Ramirez (03:29):

Or if you don't have a house by a certain age,

Ashlie Marshall (03:33):

Or if you do things out of order, if you and your significant other buy a house and you're not married yet, or if you have a kid and you don't have a house, there's all of these expectations placed on you in your head. So yeah, that's totally a great example.

(03:53):

Yeah. So I think it's really important to understand too, that with expectations, goals, you set yourself, right? Yeah. You get with your coworkers, you get with your team, maybe you get with your spouse, and you set goals in terms of, oh, I want to take this trip. Oh, I want to make sure the company's making this much money by this point in time. But goals are definitive things, and you set them to where they make you push you out of your comfort zone, but also are 100% attainable. But when it comes to expectations, I feel like we've just discussed how some are societal, some are placed on us by ourselves, some are placed in our head by our parents or our friends or our family that we may or may not have communicated, and we just create them for ourself. Have you noticed an expectation or maybe multiple that you've set for yourself or that you had in your head, I expect for this to happen or for it to be this way that you realized once you were in it that it was completely unrealistic?

Whitney Ramirez (05:05):

Oh my goodness. I don't know.

Ashlie Marshall (05:08):

Okay, so you do, but pick and choose which one you're going to talk

Whitney Ramirez (05:13):

About. I don't know. I have a heavy expectation of myself to be perfect all the time. That's probably the biggest

Ashlie Marshall (05:22):

One. Okay. Describe that though. What parts of yourself have to be perfect, be descriptive?

Whitney Ramirez (05:29):

I would say, well, definitely me as a parent. There's the parent side of it, and then it's like there's the friend side of it. I need to be the perfect friend and the perfect parent, and I need to be the perfect employee. And that is a huge part of life. And so I don't know. I feel like it's in every angle. I have put that expectation on myself when no one's ever going to be perfect at all of those things at one time.

Ashlie Marshall (06:06):

No,

Whitney Ramirez (06:07):

No one's supposed to be,

Ashlie Marshall (06:09):

No, it's a rotation, right? It's getting your full attention in the moment, at the time as you're walking through those challenges in life. So that's very good to be more in the weeds. For me, one of the biggest expectations I had before having kids and then having a kid, my first, I have a sibling who has a lot of kids, which I took care of a lot. Not in a bad way, but I chose to spend a lot of time with my niece and nephews, and that was important to my life. And then I had my own kid, and an expectation that I had was, oh, I'm still going to be able to carry on those relationships with my niece and nephews. Having a kid is not going to pull me away from that, right?

Whitney Ramirez (07:07):

Yeah,

Ashlie Marshall (07:08):

Totally unrealistic expectation. And it's very evident because my youngest nephew was only two years older than my son, my first kid. And the relationship that I have with him is vastly different than the relationship I have with his older brothers. And realizing that that expectation was not realistic at all, and that I was going to have to put in extra effort to make sure I spent time with my youngest nephew to get to the same point that I was, my will's nephew. That was heartbreaking. Realizing I didn't know him as a toddler, the way I knew his brothers as toddlers, I was heartbreaking. And that's just one example of an expectation. And then it's like you're in your head like, oh, man, you suck. You're not spending time. You're not making time for him, blah, blah, blah. But then you have your own family that you're trying to feed and keep alive, and it's way

Whitney Ramirez (08:05):

Different,

Ashlie Marshall (08:06):

But you can take that type of expectation. And I have that same exact thing when it comes to work or the team or anything really, and you're on point with yours, is you expect yourself. And I know as women, we definitely expect ourselves to be on point, and that is for multiple reasons. It's ingrained in us from our parents, or it's ingrained in us by society. Look at social media. You have all these people posting on social media about all the great high points of their life, and you have this expectation in your head like, oh, well, I could do that too. I need to be able to be on point with everything, my clothes. I should pick out those clothes to wear. I should do my hair and makeup every day.

Whitney Ramirez (08:52):

And it also is what you saw growing up too, because my mom and grandma were both very, I mean, lack of better words, shallow, so makeup every day. My grandma got her hair done at the beauty salon every Sunday. No, it was

Ashlie Marshall (09:12):

Saturday. I think that's generational.

Whitney Ramirez (09:13):

It was, yeah. But if my mom didn't wear makeup, she was sick or something. And then as she wanted to put makeup on me as a kid, and so from a very young age, I'm like, I have to wear makeup.

Ashlie Marshall (09:33):

That's so intriguing because my mother and my mother's mother were the same way. My dad's mother, I don't remember as much about her, but she was a mother to nine children out of 10 years. And I'm pretty sure she didn't care what the f she looked like when she was bringing the kids to school, but I could be wrong about that. I didn't have a chance to ask her that. But my grandmother also went and got her hair done every Friday at the salon, and anytime she went out, she had her makeup on and her jewelry on, and she was dressed nice and growing up, and this is part of one of my expectations that I have perceived from others is that, well, if you don't do this, other people are going to think this about you. I'm very intentional with my words, with my kids.

(10:28):

I never say, well, if you don't brush your teeth, everybody's going to say you have a smelly breath. That's not what I say. No. We talk about how it's important to have healthy teeth, and we don't want to have stinky breath. We don't talk about how other people are going to perceive our stinky breath. So it was imposed on me that other people are going to think this about you. You can't go out looking like that. Nobody's going to think you have the ability to wear nice clothes or whatever the phrase was, was one side of my parents, and then another side was more my dad. It was like, well, let's have some self-respect, and let's not walk out in our pajamas. Let's put on non pajama clothes. It wasn't go put on Sunday best. It was like, let's take your pajamas off and put on actual street wearing clothes and then go out into the street.

(11:18):

So it was like one, my mom was very much, and she does care about what other people think. That's a very deep thought in her head. And so those were expectations from her. And then my dad was more like, let's have self-respect. We're not going to let our tummies show. We're not going to wear deep cutting shirts. Obviously as you were younger, it was one thing, but when you get older is different. So I feel like expectations come from different sources, and then outside of that, it's not necessarily what they're telling us they expect from us sometimes. It's what they're not telling us that we are creating in our head. Can you think of a good example of an expectation that you thought was coming from someone but you realized it wasn't from them, it was more you thought that's how they perceived it?

Whitney Ramirez (12:08):

Oh, yeah. I mean, I think it's, I had a very hard time with taking time off for being sick because when I was in high school, I just got accused all the time about faking my illness because I didn't have a diagnosis and I was so sick all the time, but I had Crohn's, but I wouldn't eat at school, and so I wouldn't be as sick. And so it got flipped to she has an eating disorder and that's why she's so skinny and that's why she won't eat. But in reality, I was just really sick, and so I just had the expectation where I need to pretend that I'm not sick. I need to just get through the school day. But now, when in my adult life when I've tried to take time off of work, I'm like, oh, I can't not work today because people are going to think I'm just faking it and I'm not actually sick, but I am.

Ashlie Marshall (13:10):

I mean, I remember when you and I first got to where we were working more closely together, and you kept a lot of stuff from me in terms of your health and stuff, but he was like, when are you going to talk to me about it? We need to talk about this. This is something we can talk about because you keeping it all under wraps and then thinking that I had this expectation of what you should be doing even when you're sick, and it wasn't just my me that you were worried about, there was other outside forces that you were worried about.

Whitney Ramirez (13:42):

No, I was worried about everyone and what they would think

Ashlie Marshall (13:46):

Of me, what they perceived of you. Yeah,

Whitney Ramirez (13:49):

Because no one else on the team has this debilitating chronic illness that I know about, and so I just am like, oh, I can't be not normal, or they'll know I'm a weak link or whatever for

Ashlie Marshall (14:04):

You. It definitely was that for me, it was similar, but it was for my kids. It was me worrying about an expectation from our managers at the time, and the other people that I worked with, the people I worked alongside with, if I wasn't available or where I was supposed to be online when I was supposed to be there because my kid was needing a diaper change or needed to go to the restroom or I needed to make them a snack, I was highly stressed about that, but it was not some people, there was that expectation, but with my peers, it wasn't. And when I finally that I was a lot less stressed, but that was the expectation that I thought they had for me, and it was not them, it was me. That's a good example. How do we work through setting our goals and being realistic about the path to get to those goals in conjunction with what we expect to occur when we expect it to occur? What's a great narration of how to navigate that?

Whitney Ramirez (15:29):

I think the main thing that comes to my mind is my sales goals. So for example, in January, I'm like, I want to do $5,000 in monthly recurring revenue and $10,000 on in shop sales. And looking back now, that was a very moderate goal. It was attainable and it led to a good growth percentage for both companies over time. But I'm in July and I did over $50,000 in shop sales in July, and then I tripled my goal for the agency. And so now I'm looking at January and being like, okay, I set very realistic goals for myself. But then once I started doing way over that, my expectations grew. And so now I'm like, okay, well, I have new goals now, but I also kind of continuously see my expectations rising for myself, the better that I do.

Ashlie Marshall (16:49):

That's a great point. I think in terms of managing that in your head, it's really relevant for you to understand where those dollars came from, right? Yeah. Did that, and obviously we're not going to talk about that right now, but did that 50,000 come from a new customer and it's not likely that we'll get that same amount next month or the next six months, or is that something that we can perceive to be a reoccurring situation? Maybe not every month, but every quarter. So for you, it takes like, oh, I met my goals, but then evaluating where those goals, where it came from, where it originated from, I think that's really important for you, and you do a really good job of that, and I have to do a good job of that because seeing the 50 K come in for the month of July, and I'm like, all right, I need to make sure I understand, okay, well, do I count on this every month or is this a one-time situation?

(17:56):

So that's where you and I communicating on a regular basis is really important, and that's how we've been able to manage that. For me, my goals are different because I don't do sales. My goals are revolve around structure. An organization. I want to make sure that I am to this point in cleaning up our customer list every quarter. I want to go through 25% of our customer list, make sure it's accurate, make sure their invoices look good, make sure everybody's detailed information in their account is all lining up and it's cohesive. So I have that checklist. And then I also have checklists where it's like, okay, I want to make sure that I'm reviewing all of our policies. I want to make sure that I'm on top of our policies upstate and accurate. We've talked about that before. We have a couple that we need to update based on the culture that we've put out. Am I maintaining my communication with the team? Those are the goals that I set. Minor, very different. They're not monetary, and that's just based on our roles, what we're doing for the company. And I think that because my goals are different in that way, it's harder for me to be lenient with my own expectations of where I'm at with my goals. It takes a lot of very true personal conversations with myself.

Whitney Ramirez (19:28):

A lot of self-awareness.

Ashlie Marshall (19:30):

Yes. And as you mentioned at the beginning, this isn't just one job, right? We are a mom, we are a wife, we are a friend, we are a sister, we are a brother. So it's realizing that we have all of these jobs and we can set goals in those different areas of our life, but what are we expecting of ourselves? What's a realistic idea of, okay, my kid spent two hours on his iPad today. Was that me being a good parent, or should I have stopped in the middle of writing that email to go and set him up doing his handwriting for an hour? So it's like those expectations. Okay, well, I didn't get to that. So as women, we would be like, you just would beat yourself up internally in your head, but learning how to not do that and learning how to give yourself grace in every aspect is really important. Otherwise, you're just going to be one big ball of disappointment.

Whitney Ramirez (20:33):

Oh, yeah, definitely. My therapist always says at the end of a session, she's like, okay, what can you do today to take care of yourself or to support yourself? And it's like, well, you do that for your friends every day. Why don't you do that to yourself?

Ashlie Marshall (20:53):

Just like I just said before we started recording, I would not talk crap to you. The way I talk crap to myself.

Whitney Ramirez (21:00):

I know I would

Ashlie Marshall (21:01):

Totally be positive and uplifting, and I, all of us need to be better at that same positive, uplifting, but that leads me to, okay, so we have expectations. We're understanding that we place them on ourselves sometimes, and other times they're placed by others. How do we know that someone else has an expectation of us or of our achievements or of our anything? How do we know?

Whitney Ramirez (21:26):

We don't. We don't. Unless they communicate it.

Ashlie Marshall (21:29):

That's right. So the biggest part of that is communication. And I think when you become a parent, you get better at it because you want your kids to understand what's expected of them. My kids are older than your kids. So this summer we made a really big point during the school year, my kids get up, they make their bed, they brush their teeth, they wash their face, they do all those things in the summer, it's something like that.

Whitney Ramirez (21:55):

Relax. Yeah.

Ashlie Marshall (21:58):

And so about three weeks into summer, my husband was like, no, this ain't happening. Dominant M's. Teeth the last two days in the morning, this is disgusting. We have to make sure he is brushed his teeth. So then we put in a little expectation, look, when you wake up in the morning, these are your list of things that are expected that you achieve before lunchtime, before you could pick up a device, you have to use the restroom, brush your teeth, wash your face, make your bed. I don't care if you're running around in your underwear, I don't care if you stay in your pajamas all day long, but you're going to do these four things. It's expected of you. Right? They're not going to know that I expect of them unless I communicate that to them. But on the reverse, how do we ask those who we perceive to have placed expectations on us? How do we have that conversation with them? What would be a good way that you would approach a conversation? If you thought that I had expectations for you and you were like, she thinks that I need to do, how would you approach me in having that conversation? What would be your strategy?

Whitney Ramirez (23:09):

I would probably ask you if my goal was similar to your expectation. And so that way I can know, am I doing what needs to be done or what should be done, or is my version of how things need to go different than yours?

Ashlie Marshall (23:29):

Yeah, that's a good way to approach it. I would be like, look, am my brain. I'm thinking, you want me to do X, y, Z?

Whitney Ramirez (23:37):

Am I on

Ashlie Marshall (23:38):

Point with that or am I off?

Whitney Ramirez (23:40):

Tell me.

Ashlie Marshall (23:40):

I don't want

Whitney Ramirez (23:41):

To know. Yeah, no, I mean, I feel like you can never say the wrong thing to the right person. If you're expressing your concerns to someone that cares and you trust, then you should never be scared about expressing your expectations,

Ashlie Marshall (24:02):

Being okay with being fiercely honest and expecting the same fierce honesty from everyone else that you communicate with or approach like that.

Whitney Ramirez (24:15):

It's healthy.

Ashlie Marshall (24:16):

It's very healthy. And sometimes it sucks and it sometimes leads to not fun conversations, but once you're through that conversation and you have a better understanding, it's a lot better. So we've got goals. It's important to set them in a way that's achievable, attainable, realistic, but the difference between the goals that you set and the expectations that you place on yourself and the process of achieving those goals, there has to be a healthy balance. And you have to communicate expectations. And that's not just work. That's everything. My husband, we've said this before, he does all the laundry. So I have this expectation of, okay, once a week, there's going to be three baskets of clothes in the room. I'm going to dump 'em on the bed and fold 'em and put 'em away. His expectation would be when there's three baskets in the room, you better dump 'em and put 'em on the bed and start folding them because I fold the clothes. And so us communicating what those expectations are is really important. Sometimes I don't get to those baskets right away,

Whitney Ramirez (25:24):

And then

Ashlie Marshall (25:25):

In my head I'm like, oh, he's going to get so mad at me. He's going to be so frustrated sitting in our room in the corner of the room, and it's just not the case. That's what I think he's thinking. And he is like, I didn't even notice that they were sitting because I'm so focused on getting through work. So communicating those expectations is crucial. Crucial. Do you find it challenging to communicate expectations with anybody in your circle? Work, family, friends?

Whitney Ramirez (25:54):

I feel like, no, not anymore. I think I don't have any problem communicating them. I more so have a problem with setting unrealistic expectations for people.

Ashlie Marshall (26:07):

For you, for other people?

Whitney Ramirez (26:09):

Yeah. Okay. And then I'm not, no, I'm setting unrealistic expectations for myself.

Ashlie Marshall (26:21):

Oh, other people to other side of that relationship?

Whitney Ramirez (26:24):

I think so, because in my head I'm like, oh, I know what I need, but I can't ask them for it. But it's only if it's something that involves me, I guess.

Ashlie Marshall (26:38):

Okay. I'm curious, elaborate. I don't know. Use me and you, for example, what's something that we haven't talked about where you've done that?

Whitney Ramirez (26:52):

It goes kind of back to what you say, where it's like, I feel like shameful or regretful asking you for something that if you asked me, I'd be like, absolutely. Duh.

Ashlie Marshall (27:09):

Well, we're just going to have to work on that.

Whitney Ramirez (27:11):

I don't know, but it's like I have, and it's something I'm working on in the is because it's like I've neglected myself for so long that it's like I feel very guilty

Ashlie Marshall (27:25):

Asking

Whitney Ramirez (27:25):

For anything.

Ashlie Marshall (27:27):

Yeah, and you're saying, but if somebody asked you for it, you wouldn't hesitate. It would be like, or yes, I'll do

Whitney Ramirez (27:34):

That, or whatever. I don't deserve it, but they do. That's how I

Ashlie Marshall (27:38):

Am. I see. Okay. So more of an understanding that you are just as deserving as somebody who's asking you for an equivalent thing, whether it's a task or an item or whatever that might be.

Whitney Ramirez (27:51):

Yeah. It's like I have higher expectations, but I communicate lower expectations, I guess.

Ashlie Marshall (27:59):

Okay. Well, that's another whole thing. Do we have high expectations for our team and do we not communicate it? I don't think so. I think we very, very realistically give expectations out. I think expectations are harder to manage when they're our own for ourself. So with that being said, what have been your realizations, dear listener, on expectations that you feel you've set for yourself or you perceived to be put on you from others only to realize they were not true? Tell us your story. We want to know. And if you enjoyed listening to us ramble about goals and expectations, please drop us a review and share with your friends. We'd love to have you share this with anybody who you feel is struggling with the same thing. The day in, day out struggle.

Whitney Ramirez (29:09):

Thank you.

Ashlie Marshall (29:10):

Thanks. See y'all later.

‍